Popularity of full size vans

[KDS]

Back when I was a kid (I'm 37), my parents had two full size vans, the first an 82 Ford Econoline and then a 94 Ford Econoline high top decked out by Mark III.  It had a TV, VCR and Nintendo!  I still have fond memories of playing Duck Hunt while my dad swerved to try to make me miss!  We weren't the only family to have a full size van, with my best friend down the street having one too.  We pulled our boat to the lake every weekend, and took family road trips.  It was my dad's daily driver during the week. 

 

I know times change and gas prices and the search for better fuel economy have had a large affect, but now that I'm back in a full size van for the first time since 1997 (when my parents sold their van) and for the first time in my adult life, I can't for the life of me figure out why these things aren't flying off the shelves. 

 

I have an 02 F-250 that I bought new and love.  My wife and I have taken many road trips, camping adventures and fishing trips with the boat in that truck and it is still my baby after 260,000 miles.  We'd put our two black labs in the back seat and off we went.  Sadly both dogs passed away at 13 last year, but we plan to get 2 more dogs in the future. 

 

Almost 2 years ago, we adopted 2 boys out of the foster care system and they are now 12 and 8.  My mom also lives with us and the truck was no longer big enough.  I also have a 98 Ford Expedition with 240,000 miles that is still in good shape, but the transmission is no longer up for towing the boat and when we put everyone in it, there is no room for gear. 

 

I'm so excited to have a vehicle that can carry our family of 5, dogs, gear and tow the boat.  It does things my Expedition could never do and does some things better than my F-250 does (like being able to secure everything inside a locked vehicle rather than an unsecure truck bed). 

 

Maybe we aren't the average family, but I can't figure out why anyone with kids would choose a full size SUV over an NV.  I'm probably preaching to the choir, but does anyone else feel this way?

[radin2son]

Great bio!

 

We weren't able to afford a van until '84, when we bought a used VW camper. It wasn't long before our daughters, now in their 40s, became more interested in friends and school activities than camping trips. Our various dogs never gave up on van adventures.

 

As you can see below, the dogs get the lower accommodations. There is some nice looking upholstery under the many protective layers... it is pointless trying to keep them from tracking things in.

 

The cooler is used for items that won't fit in the small fridge and don't need to be cold. It can be plugged in by only keeps things about 20* cooler than the ambient temperature. We often refer to it as the loft for the black dog as she stretches out on top.

[ASD Dad]

I think one big reason is the lack of full size van options out there.  You have the old Express and E series vans that have not been touched in years technology wise and do not drive well compared to a modern vehicle.  The new Sprinters and Transits are getting more popular but they do not have the ability to tow much weight.  SUV's are going the same route.  Excursion is long gone.  3/4 T GM SUV's are no longer for sale brand new unless you are a government agency.  The last versions of the 3/4T 'burb and Yukon also had very soft suspension for ride comfort vs. towing ability so they needed upgrades brand new if you wanted to actually use it as intended.  That leaves very few large SUV's left.  Some have decent ratings but dont seat as many or are very tight if you use all rows for seats (Sequoia comes to mind).  Expedition XL is among the last around to still tow decent and seat more than 5 OK.  Even the newest Armada that has the new Nissan V8 and transmission in it is smaller than before due to it being based off the global Patrol model.  

 

If you want to carry a lot of people/pets/and gear that would be stowed inside AND you want to be able to tow anything with decent weight there is really only one option - the Nissan NV.  We looked months and researched a ton and there just isnt anything else like our van out there right now.  

 

If you just need to carry passengers then you can argue the Sprinter / Transit offer viable options vs the NV.  Some are even larger than the NV if you really have a lot to carry.  

 

Nice bonus is we have the best warranty period.  

Edited April 19, 2017 by ASD Dad

[mk1_62]

We had an 89 Chevy conversion van growing up, I'm 37 also. I bought my uncle's 91 Chevy conversion about 13 years ago for towing a boat.

 

I finally sold that after it's been sitting for the last few years. My wife has a minivan and I had a Camry as my daily driver. I needed something that I could throw plywood or building materials in for weekend projects or just haul all 3 kids in car seats on long trips. The sienna just feels a bit cramped after a few hundred miles.

 

I agree, these things are a better choice than large SUV's and leagues ahead of the competition in features and towing for a family van. I test drove them all and the Nissan is the only van I would even think about right now.

[radin2son]

Granted, a VW would never be considered a full size van, but we never considered anything larger. Domestic offerings were either work, window or "leisure" vans, but we were wrong in thinking this. Sportsmobile has converted Fords, Dodges and Chevys for 50 years. Some are still in use. They look like a house built in the '70s with the original kitchen.

 

Just had this memory of my first encounter with an Econoline. It was 1964 or 65 and I was visiting my cousin. He worked for a small magazine distributor, doing what I don't remember. The business's Econoline was his hideout on weekends. I seem to recall cigarettes and Playboy. No keys, so the van never moved. I'm sure we never noticed...

Edited April 20, 2017 by radin2son

[JCattSS]

The automakers need to do a better job at offering more passenger friendly vans, and styling. A big part of the problem vans present to us are comfort and amenities. Our last van a 2014 Chevy Express left me feeling GM could care less about building a comfortable van for families. Despite our efforts to make the Express what we wanted if fell short. They make great work vehicles but really suck for families. I would bet the now discontinued E series is about the same. Now we are left choosing from the Transit, which to me just felt flimsy and awkward after putting about 1700 miles around Utah in one. I was actually looking forward to getting back in our Express. Bring in the NV which covers many of the other vans shortcomings. Its still a few options off from a well equipped mini van or nice suv, but its close. Nissan could really hit it out of the park for minimal dollars by adding a few things like adjustable pedals, padded arm rests, power slider, a few others. These items could be optional. At the end of the day if you have a large family or need more than 7-8 seats your options are limited and the automakers know this. Nissan is heading in the right direction though. I have no experience with a sprinter. 

 

Our 15 passenger Express. We had around 65k wrapped up in this, far more than our NV and was disappointed. The NV is better in so many ways. Ended up giving it to my sister. 

[radin2son]

According to www.goodcarbadcar.net van sales last month were down 8%. More NVs were sold in March 2017 than in March 2016, BUT sales numbers are much lower than other vans. 5819 Chevy Express vs 1863 NVs. No data on NVPs vs NVs.

 

NV200 outsold NVs by 34...

 

Tongue in cheek, it will take an Infinity version and a separate production line to get NVPs into the SUV category.

 

In Zion last month just before they closed the road to cars, a guy in an Express stopped on the road and yelled, "Is that a rental...cool."

Edited April 21, 2017 by radin2son

[JCattSS]

I wonder what the breakdown between passenger vs. cargo looks like for the others, and production numbers. There aren't usually many NV passenger vans at the local Nissan dealer. I don't go by super often but have never seen more than one on the lot. 

[radin2son]

For whatever reason, goodcarbadcar doesn't bring up US commercial van sales. Google van sales march 2017. Van stats are also there for Canada.

[ASD Dad]

On my recent trip to FL I saw several NVP's including another one towing a small camper.  Normally I see 1 or 2 on that trip but there are definitely more out there now.  I still see way more Cargo's of course.  

 

What is weird is I used to see a lot of Transits.  This trip I think I saw 2 so it was the exact opposite vs. the NVP for prior trips.  Not sure where they all went so quickly!  Our neighbor has a high top/mid top? passenger Transit 350 that is a conversion van.  I have never talked to them (they're a street over) but see them all the time.  It looks nice when I have seen it up close.  The Transit I thought about renting for fun when my van was in the body shop looked horrible!  Very cheap looking inside.  

 

Forgot - one thing I have noticed is more Titans.  I did not see any until recently other than 2 with dealer tags.  In the past couple weeks I have seen several.  All but two were Cummins.  

Edited April 21, 2017 by ASD Dad

[NVAir]

Upgrade the interior another level and add 4x4 option and these NV's would be tough to beat. As is I'm on the fence.

[mk1_62]

I would love to see more options on this van, but I don't think the sales numbers would dictate a lot more time and effort going into it. This is a niche vehicle, and I feel Nissan will sort of treat it like that. The cargo version is by far more popular, so I could see changes there that could trickle over to the passenger version.

 

I agree though that a few more interior amenities and this van could easily be in the mid $50s and frankly a very nice high end vehicle.

[KDS]

I pulled my boat for the first time this weekend and I can see why people are choosing this van if they need to pull a trailer.  Great power at all speeds and plenty of acceleration.  Unfortunately the only thing this van won't pass is a gas station.  She gets very thirsty.  I guess that's all gas V8s though.  One thing Nissan seriously needs to consider is dual tanks or a larger gas tank.  If someone makes a kit to relocate the spare tire to the door and add a second tank, I'd buy it in a second! 

[radin2son]

www.outsidevan.com in Portland, OR built a 4x4 NV, aka Yukon, with a 100 gallon tank. I never had much luck pulling up NV info on www.expeditionportal.com but KMG and Jon Nelson post there.

 

SMB did a video on a prototype Eseries cutaway with custom made Eseries lookalike, a minuscule amount wider, for the back portion. The comment by the driver was that it needed a range of 600 mi and diesel to be a world rover.

 

Not that you need this range, but you may get some ideas...

Edited April 24, 2017 by radin2son