Shocked by amount that tow unsafe

[ASD Dad]

So I have been a member of the FB NV page for a while now and to be honest I am shocked how many people tow campers that have Zero clue about towing, safety, etc.  

 

Many people on there brag about towing 70+ mph with 8000# DRY campers.  These same people have 5+ kids along with husband/wife driving in the NV.  I can say with 99.9% certainty that they have never been to any type of scale and they are absolutely overweight for the van's specs.  I will also say that with the vast majority they are most likely on the cheap OEM camper tires that love to blow up at normal speeds let alone 20% over rated capacity like these families.  

 

One insisted they were safe with their 6 kids, 34' dual slide bunkhouse that I think was over 8000 pounds empty from the factory and said they didnt see the point in towing 55 mph so they regularly went 70-75 and got 6 mpg so they wanted a bigger gas tank.  "We can tow 8900 pounds so we are fine".  Idiots.

 

Seriously?!?  I wonder if they would be so arrogant at 75 mph when their tire blows up into 100 pieces and either mangles their trailer or worse causes them to wreck.  I've experienced tires blowing up and I have seen the damage they can cause on other campers.  I had a TPMS system that alerted me so we got off lucky.  Many are not.  I bet I pass at least one camper per trip that is sidelined with a blown tire when we take our long trips.

 

I'm not going to be one that says you need a dually to tow a decent sized camper but learn the limits and ask yourself if going over is worth the danger to your family.  All those idiots with giant families are pushing their luck hard.  The tow rating on our vans does NOT include a half dozen kids and all the stuff to go along with a family that size!  

 

<rant off>

[TinyStudio]

Agreed! Review the total GVW, front to back weight distribution, tongue weight, and play it safe. Not to mention the weight of fresh, grey, and black tanks.

[Mark Rogers]

Unsafe towing is a really big problem, but there are other safety issues that are even more common.  I frequently see headrests adjusted incorrectly, passengers with their feet on the dashboard, passengers sitting reclined while the vehicle is in motion, etc.  And I've talked to plenty of parents who have no idea how to install or adjust their children's car seats.

 

We have an epidemic of "failure to read the instructions."

[radin2son]

Keeping it Nissan NV specific, only so much safety can be built into our NVs. Same for NV abuse allowances for towing and tires.

 

In Tucson, perhaps all of AZ, we have a summer “monsoon” stupid motorist law. Get stuck in a running wash and need to be saved, you pay.

Maybe, this needs to be more broadly applied.

[Mark Rogers]

In Tucson, perhaps all of AZ, we have a summer “monsoon” stupid motorist law. Get stuck in a running wash and need to be saved, you pay.

Maybe, this needs to be more broadly applied.

 

I like that law.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stupid_Motorist_Law

[mk1_62]

The problem with towing overweight is safety for you and other drivers. If you have your feet on the dash or your headrest too low your only hurting yourself. Having a blowout and fishtailing on the highway at 70+ may very well kill someone else.

 

I've experienced blowouts with no trailer and it's terrifying.

 

I've found never underestimate people's stupidity.

[ASD Dad]

Exactly.  You want to risk yourself or family that is on you 100%.  You put MY family at risk for your stupidity then we have problems!  I called out several on that page and none have answers.  Ignorance is not an excuse.  These same people will be the ones suing the tire company or camper company after they total their NV and end up in the hospital.  I would definitely be suing them if they take me out on the road!

[Bamps]

I tow a big huge 14’ trailer with my NV. It’s gvwr is 3532 and my NV max is 7100. Thats about close enough to the limit as I’ll get. I slow down too, its not that hard.

[andy_george]

Too many people are given licenses that don’t possess the skills to drive, much less tow. And law enforcement rarely penalizes stupid, unsafe decisions unless it’s a commercial vehicle.

 

And this is why I believe within 20 years it will literally be a fight to be able to operate a vehicle ourselves. Most of society is beating the door down to fully autonomous vehicles, and like always, the lowest common denominator dictates what the rest of us are forced to deal with.

[ASD Dad]

EDIT:  I stand corrected on below.  He replied back that it only weighs 6800 lbs dry.  That is amazingly light, my much shorter camper weighs the same.  Still not sure I would want to pull a 34' camper with the NV but it's great he knows the weights.

 

Idiots strike again.  Today there is a family posting photos of a 34 foot triple axle (!!) Airstream hooked up to his NV.  Beautiful campers and the vintage ones can be fairly light for their size but I am guessing that camper loaded has to be over weight plus at 34' you really want a long wheelbase truck if possible.  

Edited February 16, 2018 by ASD Dad

[radin2son]

Are these posts on FB? ASD Dad, you and others have provided many useful posts on this.

 

We are on our home from Kofa National Wildlife Refuge and witnessed the migration north of the snow birds. Population doubles in Yuma and Quartzite from October to March. Mostly RV coaches towing jeeps/atvs. High winds today and they are all over the road. Some of the very large 5th wheel towers also have a second trailer with a Jeep or multiple atvs. Tow vehicles seem adequate...

[rolliew]

It's the ricer diesels with the small weenies that like to tow race. Douchebags.

[radin2son]

Still seeing too many small vehicles towing... 

 

This past trip, we came across a 90's Suburban, towing the largest Airsteam, that lost control on a paved, steep downhill in a canyon. The Suburban detached and was backwards into the cliff wall, while the Airstream was downhill across the road. Tow end was smashed in and it looked like it also hit the cliff wall. 

 

What is the best vehicle to tow? Horse power, torque? What is the max tow capability for NVs?

[Mark Rogers]

The max tow capacity for the 2018 3500 NV's varies between 6200 and 9400 pounds, depending on which features you have.  I'm not sure what it is for the 1500 and 2500, but I'm guessing it's lower.  And, of course, cargo in the van also reduces the towing capacity.  I see a lot of Facebook posts from NV owners who somehow think it's okay to buy a trailer with a dry weight over 9000 pounds, then they load both the van and trailer with cargo.  Not good!

[ASD Dad]

Facebook is full of those idiots and we correct them and they dont care.  They say "I towed 12,000# over the Rockies and was fine!".  You're fine until you are Not fine and then you are somebody else can be Dead!  

 

Last I looked the combined weight was and still is 16,000 lbs for trailer and NV (on the V8 3500).  Doesnt matter how you get to those 16,000 lbs but that is the max you should be towing.  Period.  I dont care if you have the latest and greatest tires, air bags, helper springs or who knows what added.  All you did is REDUCE your capacity adding a lot of that since it is all added weight!!  

[radin2son]

I get what you both say, but is a fully loaded NV or NVP realistically a good tow vehicle? How much can you safely tow?

 

We are about 1000# under the max payload and I wouldn’t consider towing. I do like tow mode and use it on steep hills with manual mode. This past trip we spent a lot of time in 1st and 2nd on dirt roads. We had to stop on an uphill section where a tourist was digging fwd holes until he finally backed up to get a running start.

[andy_george]

The NV is a good tow vehicle. It has the mass, frame, suspension, and brakes to tow safely, given an experienced, skilled driver. The problem is that as tow vehicles have gotten more capable (many claim to be able to tow enough to affect the rotation of the earth) trailers have gotten much larger, longer, and heavier over the past 10+ years. So while the specs and ratings of the NV could pull most of the larger trailers from the early 2000’s, today that’s not the case.

 

But I must say that the NV pulling a 10,000lb. trailer, while it is over it’s tow rating, seems safer to me than a new heavy duty pickup pulling a 20,000lb. trailer, which is within its tow rating. Physics don’t lie.... a tow vehicle weighing 6-7,000lbs. towing something over twice it’s weight hooked to the back bumper is treading on thin ice in an emergency maneuver.

[Mark Rogers]

I get what you both say, but is a fully loaded NV or NVP realistically a good tow vehicle? How much can you safely tow?

 

We are about 1000# under the max payload and I wouldn’t consider towing. I do like tow mode and use it on steep hills with manual mode. This past trip we spent a lot of time in 1st and 2nd on dirt roads. We had to stop on an uphill section where a tourist was digging fwd holes until he finally backed up to get a running start.

 

I don't tow, so all I can suggest is that you stick to the rated limits and follow the instructions in Nissan's towing guide.

 

But I have to agree that tow mode is super useful, even when not towing.  That's one of my favorite features!

[ASD Dad]

NV tows way better than my old Tundra did.  Beefier frame, axle, springs, etc.  Tundra had more power but NV pulls nicer once moving.  I think it is an excellent tow vehicle for somebody that needs space.  It is the only vehicle in the class that can do what it does which is why we bought one.  The old vehicles that could do this (the 3/4T Burb and Excursion) are not made anymore.  The Chevy Express is ancient.

 

Towing is always a balancing act.  I agree that a new dually Ram towing a triple axle fifth wheel that is 45' long is scary looking but it does "work".  Look at a commercial big rig.  That trailer outweighs the cab by a whole lot if you are talking about a non-sleeper semi pulling a trailer locally.  You have non-sleepers pulling tandems or even triples depending on the state laws (UPS and FedEx do it all the time).  Physics doesnt lie and those accidents are often horrible or fatal but it is what it is out there these days.

 

I try and stay 10-15% under max guidelines to give some extra headroom for safety.  

[trdriver71]

I have a commercial Class 1 licence and I agree that some of the things I have seen on the FB page are a little scary some are really pushing the limits of their NV my little trailer compared to others is a great size for many places including most campsites that can't accommodate trailers more than 28' my trailer is a 26' and well within the towing capacity of my NV. I used to have my LCV licence and could tow 2 53' trailers and could weigh a maximum GVW 140000LBS but of coarse you have to be licenced for a regular tractor trailer for a minimum of 3 years before you can get your LCV licence and have to take other courses as well. I also think it is crazy that some new pickups have a towing capacity of 30000LBS I have seen what happens to a pickup when they have to slam on the brakes and try to control that kind of weight or get into an accident and hit a tractor trailer because they ran a light because they couldn't stop. the pickup truck got bent into a upside down u shape because the trailer kept pushing after they hit the tractor trailer