Stillen Stage 2 Supercharger

[Decades]

If any are interested, some details are on this Facebook page (not mine):

http://www.tidewaterz.com/

 

Bottom line: it will work, but with modifications/fabrication.  Todd at Tidewater Z did the install and documented the project for Stillen.  I just picked it up tonight, and I probably won't have after dyno data for a few weeks.

 

The power to weight ratio (with power numbers from Stillen's dyno chart) puts the supercharged NV at close to a stock Titan.  I've only put less than 40 miles on it so far, but I love that sound!

Decades

 

Edit: some pictures are up in my gallery.

Edited September 26, 2013 by Decades

[TJS6]

I had that kit on my 2005 Titan and 2007 Armada.  It makes a huge difference and I was waiting to see if anyone was going to put one on the NV.  I would recommend the Banks Intake and Exhaust if you already haven't made any changes there.  I have the exhaust installed and waiting on the intake to see how i have to modify it to work on the NV.

[Decades]

TJS6,

     Thanks for the recommendation- from what I've seen on Titan forums it looks like the Banks exhaust is a favorite but the major criticism is that it is loud- is it?  I may be giving up some power for less rumble, but I've ordered the Stillen exhaust for the Titan (I think it is the crew cab, long bed, whichever one was for the longest wheelbase truck) w/ the single passenger side exit and it should be here next Tuesday.  I hope to have some post-install dyno numbers soon after.

     It has a K&N filter in the stock housing now, I am thinking of going with the Airaid intake, since Xavman was able to install that with only an extra spacer needed- http://nissannvforum.com/topic/134-upgrading/

Decades

[TJS6]

The banks is louder but noticeably more power and better gas millage!  The setup on the Titan defiantly has more power.  The setup for the two cars I had are below.  With the Titan driving mostly highway I was averaging 19-21 mpg and with the Armada the best i could get was 16-18 mpg.

 

2005 Titan Crew Cab 2WD 

Volant Intake with RAM Scoop (changed to Banks when they came out with their RAM intake but ended up putting the volant back in after 6 months)

 

http://volant.com/edetail.asp?ID=716

http://bankspower.com/products/show/?option_id=318%7C74%7CGas%20Trucks%2C%20%0A04-11%20Nissan%20-%205.6L%20Titan%7C3

 

Banks Monster Exhaust

 

http://bankspower.com/products/show/?option_id=89%7C74%7CGas%20Trucks%2C%20%0A04-11%20Nissan%20-%205.6L%20Titan%7C6

 

2007 Armada 2WD

Stillen Intake 

Magnaflow Exhaust

[Decades]

TJS6,

     I'm interested to see easy or difficult your Banks intake fits- any reason you went back to the Volant, and why you are not trying the Volant on the NV?  I didn't see a Banks unit for Nissan that has the scoop.  Are you supposed to cut out those elliptical spots in the front of the Banks air box also?

Decades

[TJS6]

I went back to the Volant on the Titan because the Banks doesn't have the scoop for the Titans.  The scoop and clean cold air made a huge difference in power and mpg over the banks.  I got a call from Stillen yesterday saying that you put their exhaust on and didn't have any issues.  How was the fit and how much extra work did you have to do with the hangers and adjustments.

[Decades]

TJS6,
I received the exhaust last week but was unable to have it installed until today. Todd at Tidewater Z is putting it on and he had to make some alterations to make it fit. I think the flanges would need to be re-oriented, he had to add some tubing due to the Quigley transfer case, and add some tubing aft of the muffler/resonator. That changed the locations of the hangars so they had to be changed, too.
I'm surprised- I laid it out last night and eyeballed it and it didn't seem different, but an inch or two here and there translates into a good bit of fabrication to make it fit. I'll post pics in my gallery once it stops raining here, turns out I won't be picking it up tonight due to a family issue on my end.
I am still waiting on the Uprev tune before the "after" dynos.
Decades

 

Also, I've put two tanks of gas through it since the supercharger install, but before the exhaust.  The first tank I calculated 10.6 mpg, the second (driving it like I usually do) was 12 mpg (27.2 mph indicated as avg).  probably 80/20 city/hwy for both.  I'm still less than 2500 miles, and with the exhaust it may get better.  The two tanks before the supercharger were both 11 mpg, still mostly city driving but including two sets of dyno runs.  All of these mpg calculations take into account the larger tire size (6% greater than metered; the original tires were 6% less than metered based on speed metered vs. handheld GPS.)  I've yet to go on a long highway trip since changing the tires and putting on the supercharger.

 

My initial impressions of the supercharger are very positive.  Driving normally I wouldn't suspect that it is supercharged, but it does pull right from the start.  It is very easy to find RPMs above 2.5k from a normal start when before I was rarely above 2.1k.  At idle the engine feels/sounds a little noisier or maybe has more vibration to it.  It may be my imagination but I feel like it is coming from the serpentine belt.  Only as the RPMs get above about 3k can you hear the whine building under harder acceleration, and the power seems very linear.  I've yet to actually floor it, but I suspect that there is an interlock preventing full power until around 40 mph like there might be on 2WD Titans.  Sometimes there doesn't seem to be a change at that speed, but I've noticed an abrupt change more than once right at 40- not a downshift, but a surge in power.

Edited October 10, 2013 by Decades

[Decades]

TJS6,

     Got the van back today with the Stillen exhaust installed.  The one I got was part 503257, the Titan cat back single side exhaust for the crew cab long bed since I figured that it would be easier to shorten tubing than to weld on more.  I was wrong- it wasn't a simple matter of shortening a few pieces of the straight tubing.  It needed the changes described above, but Todd did a great job in making it work.  Did your Banks exhaust on the NV require significant changes too?

     It is defiantly louder than stock and quite a bit louder than I expected.  Even with the throttle cracked open for normal acceleration there is a deep bass rumble (it sounds like I should be accelerating MUCH faster :) ).  I would say that the exhaust rumble is the dominant sound inside the cabin now, but not loud enough to interfere with normal conversation at cruising speed.  On the plus side it makes the idle whir of the serpentine belt/supercharger completely unnoticeable, if I hadn't driven it without the high flow exhaust I wouldn't have noticed it at all.

     Overall I am very satisfied with it and I would choose to do it again over the stock exhaust even with the added expense of modifications and all.  I will investigate adding a resonator to quiet it down even more, though.

[WFC]

Decades, firstly congratulations on having the balls to do this, awesome! I guess it's what a lot of us would like to do if we could, I know I would.

Are you planning to upgrade the Brakes too?!

Did you manage to disable the speed Limiter in the ECU? Or was it more acceleration you were aiming for?

I'd love to see/hear a video!

[Decades]

Dyno graphs posted in my gallery from before and after.

 

WFC,

     Thanks- it honestly was the first thing I thought of when I found out it was the same engine as the Titan, I had it planned from before I bought the van and really was hoping it would work out.

     I have heard that there are at least 3 more supercharged NVs in the works, I can't wait to see them.

     I am happy with the brakes and I don't think I am going to change them- they are good enough for a fully loaded van and for towing; adding the supercharger hasn't really changed how fast I drive, I just accelerate a little better (more pep is what I was after.)

     When the first dyno runs were done, they said the speed limiter was set at about 110 mph (I think that is around 6k RPM in 3rd) I don't think I'll ever know if it was removed or not.  There was surging at around 40MPH under harder acceleration (not WOT) I had associated it with a WOT/Speed interlock, but after the Stillen/UpRev tune (installed 11/13/2013) it seems to be gone- now the acceleration is smooth at any given throttle input (only really tested through about 1/2 throttle) and smoothly pressing down on the throttle results in a linear acceleration response.  Bottom line- the van is much more fun to drive.

     I have a video from one of the after dyno sessions, but I'm not sure if I can add it to the gallery.  The air sound from the dyno's tailpipe sensor dominates the sound until the runs start, I'm not sure the recorder I used was up to the task of capturing the sound of the runs.  It really sounds like a muscle car with the exhaust. the supercharger wails like a banshee, and it was really something to see in excess of three and a half tons of boxy ugliness strain against the ratchet straps as it squatted from the acceleration.  I was probably standing in a bad spot for the video :)

     TJS6, I still need to take some pictures of the exhaust.  Is one on the supercharged NV's in the works yours?  Supposedly one is a 2500 w/ the V8, should have a much better power to weight ratio than my silver elephant.

[Decades]

Video (if this works)

Just the good part of the Dyno (short sound byte really- had to edit it to get it less than the 500MB limit)

Edited: Swapped the video for the full run instead of just a throttle bump (Run 8 at Abacus Racing from the graphs in my gallery)

 

NV56SCPull.wmv

 

11/23/13: Added 2 more STD-corrected graphs to my gallery (to better compare to Stillen's graphs) and 3 pictures of the exhaust.

Edited November 23, 2013 by Decades

[Tatunka]

Hey Decades,

 

Just wondering if you could give us an update on your experience with the supercharger and if you know if Stillen has made a kit for the NV with the changes your installer documented.

 

Thanks

[Decades]

Tatunka,

     I called Stillen today- on their website they do not list any details but if you call the Sport Truck division (866)25Zero-553Seven and speak to J.T. he can pass on the info that Todd at Tidewater Z collected as he installed mine.  They are working on NV changes to the install instructions for the Titan kit.

     It has been a year and I only have about 15k miles on the odometer since the install.  Zero issues with the supercharger although very recently a local Nissan dealership did not want to work on an unrelated problem because the van was "heavily modified" (the problem turned out to be a connection issue with the wiring harness connection on the transmission that caused the ESC light (not the one that is controlled by the button, the one to the left of it), CRUISE light, and SET (for c. control) blinking- an issue with the transmission speed sensor signal, I think, which makes the van almost un-drivable until fixed- removing and reconnecting the wiring harness corrected the issue.)

     The only thing I have not taken care of with my install are two CEL codes that are for the 2nd set of O2 sensors that show a (false) lean condition.  I need to request that those CEL codes be deleted with an UpRev code change, I just have not taken care of it yet (I just mentioned it to JT today when I spoke with him.)  I don't know if this is an issue because of the headers and B-pipes or if it would be there on just a supercharger install with a cat-back exhaust.  I used to clear the code when it came up with a handheld code scanner; I stopped bothering with it since it doesn't bother me, and the CEL light will blink if any new codes show up.  I also still need to put in a cold air intake instead of just the K&N filter I have in the stock air box now.

     I don't know how much you travel, but if you are ever in the Virginia Beach area you are welcome to take it for a test drive if you are considering having one installed.

[Tatunka]

Thanks for the reply, it’s always one of those thing I look at but just haven't committed it to yet. As far as the "heavily modified" comment, it must be a response that Nissan teaches its new service personnel. They used it on me and the 4x4 system from Quigly, even though it's fully warrantied by Nissan :-)

[Decades]

I may have spoken too soon.

Long story short, the van is currently at Level 10 Performance in Hardyston, NJ.  The transmission is being upgraded to their Bulletproof package.

 

I was driving to Buffalo, NY this past week/weekend by way of Pittsburgh, and while I was still in Virginia on 12/18 the van shifted hard from first to second- very abruptly, like hitting a pothole.

About 15 minutes later I put the transmission in manual mode to see if I could get better fuel economy in the hills heading into West Virginia, and I ended up seeing the transmission slip (RPMs went up about 500 RPM with no increase in acceleration or speed, and the burning smell came into the cabin.)  I shifted out of manual and switched to monitor the transmission temp- it was at about 1/3rd of the bar, which is higher than I have seen it, but not pegged high.  No problems the rest of the day except the thumping shift from first to second.  Spent the night and the next day (12/19) near Pittsburgh, no problems, but only drove while cold (transmission temps never got above 2 or 3 bars, shifting was normal) but ambient air temp was also around freezing.

Drove from Pittsburgh to Buffalo on 12/20, no problems noted, but I also didn't need to stop at all.

Drove from Buffalo to Pittsburgh on 12/21, after the vehicle warmed up the hard shift from 1st to 2nd started again.  The longer it was driven, the more time it seemed to stay in first gear, and the higher the RPMs seemed to get before shifting to 2nd.  Once it was in 2nd, everything else seemed normal.  Found the closest Nissan dealership with the Commercial Vehicle service (Monroeville, PA) and took it there on 12/21- (I had read on a Titan forum that someone had a hard shifting problem at around 20k and a transmission flush fixed it.)  They flushed it and said that there was material in the fluid.

    I found Level 10 Performance Transmissions through a Titan site, and figured it would be better to upgrade than to replace with the same.  Dropped the van off there last night.

    By the time I had stopped driving it (had to get it towed the last 75 miles to Level 10) the engine wouldn't accelerate and RPMs were "hunting" around 1.8k at about 45-55 MPH.  I was going fine until I hit traffic, the shifting became horrible (4k before shifting, with nowhere near the acceleration associated with the throttle input.)  Finally on the side of the road with 18504 miles on the Odometer.

     The only other symptom I may have missed previously is after merging onto a highway, the van seemed to hang out in 4th gear for about 5 seconds longer than you would expect, with the throttle released but with RPMs hanging out at around 4k.  I thought that it was due to the transmission programming, it has been doing that on freeway merges as long as I can remember, although I probably didn't notice if it didn't always do it.

     I'm not sure if the transmission just couldn't handle the additional torque and HP from the supercharger or if I did some damage back in the first week of October when I had one very abrupt shift when the connection between the ECU and transmission was lost (It felt like running over a curb, but I think I was in 3rd gear at the time) which then damaged it enough that the amount of stress the transmission could take was lowered, or some combination of the two.  The third option is that it was a defective part, but that doesn't seem likely. 

    With the supercharger, peak horsepower at the wheel went from 250 to about 380 and peak torque went from about 300 to about 355 as measured on the Dyno at Abacus racing (those were the higher of the two sets of numbers from the two places I had it dyno'ed at) - I think the only time the transmission saw a that power was on the dyno, although I didn't baby the van at all.  Either way, it looks like the folks at Level 10 will fix it better than new.  I'll update when I get it back, but they may also put photos on their Facebook page.

[Tatunka]

So what happened?

[Decades]

I'm not sure what caused the problem.

     Level 10 found burnt components, but also noted the plastic body of the TCM was melted (very unusual- pictures updated to my gallery of the burnt friction components and TCM) so instead of picking up the van on 12/25, a new valve body needed to be ordered and upgraded.  I ended up picking up the van on 1/2/15 and drove it home.

     I spoke with Pat at Level 10 when I picked it up and he said that it was not so much that the transmission couldn't handle the power, it was that it wasn't calibrated for the way the power was delivered (I'm paraphrasing what he said, not a direct quote and apologize on my ignorance if this was not what he meant.)  Level 10 worked with Stillen to modify my TCM and ECU programming.  I supplied Level 10 with the before and after dyno graphs.  I was very impressed with the customer service of Level 10 and Stillen this whole time.

     I spoke with JT from Stillen today as well- Stillen has the current programming of my transmission so if anyone is interested in getting the supercharger at this point I do not think that an upgraded transmission is a requirement.  I would do it again though just for the peace of mind. 

     I'm not convinced that it was not an isolated event that caused damage to the transmission- when I had the problem I identified earlier where I had a very hard shift due to an electrical connection, the transmission fluid was checked immediately and I was specifically told that it did not smell burnt (at 14700 on the odometer).  I believe that if it was a problem with the transmission programming and/or my driving, the problem would have not suddenly appeared and there would have been signs of damage then.  The 1 to 2 shift was only noticeable when the vehicle was warm, starting at about 17300 miles, the burnt smell when in manual mode was probably around 17500, and the flush occurred at 18243 miles.  By then the damage was done, because I only made it to 18504 miles and there was friction material in the flush.  Between 18243 and 18399 (my last fill up on the PA turnpike), the only symptom was a higher and higher RPM when the 1 to 2 shift occurred, and even then only when warm.  Ever since approximately 18000 miles I drove it with my highest degree of mechanical sympathy.

     I have noticed a difference in the upgraded transmission, particularly on the 3 to 4 shift and when downshifting.  The torque converter has also been modified, and I may notice a slight difference there as well.  I've only put about 2000 miles on it since picking it up on 1/2, and have not noticed any change in fuel economy.  I haven't towed anything with it yet.  Temperatures are always in the lower 1/3 of the indicator band, ambient temperatures have been between the teens and 50's.  Usually it is only 1 - 3 bars.

     Overall, I'm very happy with it, Level 10 did a great job and has great customer service, and I have the peace of mind of a warranty on the transmission now.  Drain and fill intervals are 20,000 miles, I think it might hold an extra quart.

[Tatunka]

Thanks for the update! This peaked my intrest because I tow a lot and I have taller tires, so I'm not the easiest on the transmission. But so far the temps have never gone past half, even in 100 degree temps.  But I'll have to keep an eye on my shifting now.